| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
2bbetter
3 Posts |
 Posted - 10/05/2015 : 09:04:56
|
What do you all think? I won't mention any names or the team here.
If a team turns out to be 180 degrees from what was promised and you decide to leave, should you be entitled to any money back?
Thanks for any opinions. |
|
|
mikepayne
173 Posts |
Posted - 10/05/2015 : 09:59:46
|
| Yes. |
 |
|
|
CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 10/05/2015 : 10:05:38
|
Generally the answer is no. There was a team last year that said they would have 20 kids, turns out they had 35. They said they would play in all the high level tourneys, turns out then played in diddly little nothing tourneys.
The best advice given last year when this happened was that:
1. Make payments, do not pay all year up front, this limits your liability should they prove not to be the team you thought they were.
2. Vet teams a LOT before you join, ask last year parents, ask for a firm schedule before you submit payments...etc.
3. It's a buyer beware system, so you are unlikely to get any money back. If you truly hate it and MUST walk away then it had better be worth walking away from the money you already have down.
In the coaches defense, they schedule X amount of tourneys that they have to pre-pay for. Even though you have decided not to participate any longer it doesn't mean that money hasn't already been spent on tourney fees, uniforms, field time...etc. They can't just refund people's money if they are unhappy. |
|
|
|
turntwo
955 Posts |
Posted - 10/05/2015 : 10:14:02
|
| Contract signed? Uniforms ordered? Tourneys played? Hired-in instruction provided? Used indoor facility at all? It costs to run a team, and with examples I just asked, these can be what you've already paid for and potentially taken advantage of... I'm all for refunds, BUT, pro-rated at best. |
|
|
|
lowandoutside
69 Posts |
Posted - 10/05/2015 : 10:30:54
|
| I think you should be refunded a pro-rated portion of what you have paid. If you have practiced, played in tournaments, etc.... There is a cost involved in all of this. If a uniform has been purchased, that obviously has been spent as well. We had friends leave a team and they were told they wouldn't get any money back. They went above their coach and spoke to the gentleman responsible for the entire organization. He said they would return a pro-rated portion but had already purchased uniform and gear. They then asked for the gear since technically they paid for it. They decided to refund the full amount, less what had been spent on field time and tournaments up to that point. It is my opinion, that if they did not say there would be no refunds if you decided to leave (which some teams will tell you in advance) you should be able to recoup some of your money that has been spent. I wouldn't expect a full refund but possibly think of a reasonable amount and request it back. Take into consideration what has been spent up to the current point. |
|
|
|
jmac83
46 Posts |
Posted - 10/05/2015 : 10:52:18
|
| Maybe for a pro rata share of future practices/lessons/tournaments, but beyond that, I think caveat emptor applies, sorry. |
|
|
|
LFconcessions
29 Posts |
Posted - 10/05/2015 : 13:15:06
|
Getting $s back can happen.
My son has only moved on from a team once, and we worked with the coach to do what was fair as we did not want to leave the coach, or team, in a challenge and received a pro-rated amount back.
Do agree with CaCO3Girl's first point... make payments {on-time}.
Good Luck to ya 2bbetter. Hope it works out for the best for your son. |
Edited by - LFconcessions on 10/05/2015 13:24:54 |
|
|
|
teamgamark
163 Posts |
Posted - 10/05/2015 : 23:48:13
|
| Pro rata share is fair. If coach claims to carry a certain number and then increases numbers because he is more concerned about winning than developing. Also if a coach feeling pressure to win changes substitution strategy and starts sitting players after communicating otherwise when you agreed to play. Coach starts abusing pitching innings or your family runs into financial stresses are things as a coach I feel would be acceptable for me to refund and have when I coached travel/all-stars. Good luck never easy. |
|
|
|
AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2015 : 10:05:20
|
I only had 2 people quit. One hadn't paid anyway, the other one I refunded about $100, just so I'd never have to see the mom again.
The kid was fine and I was sorry to lose him.
Had one kid have a serious eye injury while playing w/his JV team, so he hadn't even joined us yet. I refunded them everything they had paid. Not everyone on the team agreed with that, but it was the right thing to do.
I suspect the coach won't agree that he didn't live up to his end of the deal unless something drastic did change. If I felt like that, I wouldn't feel obligated to refund. |
|
|
|
CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2015 : 10:32:32
|
quote:
Originally posted by 2bbetter
What do you all think? I won't mention any names or the team here.
If a team turns out to be 180 degrees from what was promised and you decide to leave, should you be entitled to any money back?
Thanks for any opinions.
Perhaps it would help us to know what you mean by the team turned out to be a 180 from what was promised. |
|
|
|
turntwo
955 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2015 : 11:45:24
|
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
quote:
Originally posted by 2bbetter
What do you all think? I won't mention any names or the team here.
If a team turns out to be 180 degrees from what was promised and you decide to leave, should you be entitled to any money back?
Thanks for any opinions.
Perhaps it would help us to know what you mean by the team turned out to be a 180 from what was promised.
Agreed. Could be opinions... It's VERY early to have a team do a 180... Were you told "Major" and now they registered as AAA?-- Maybe they are doing that to get in more tourneys, but fully intend to run the Major circuit in the spring? Were you told 10-11 players, but now 12-14 are showing on the roster? Could that be because of schedule conflicts in the fall?--- So far, I see plausible reasoning.
Now, if you were told: We are going to practice at XYZ park/facility, only to be playing out of a church/school/cow pasture that's 30 miles further away... Or promised "professional" coaching/instruction, yet haven't seen an ounce of that, and you've practiced 12-15 times and played in a tourney or two... Or were told/shown a budget that included "indoor" and have yet to see/experience that aspect-- especially with all the rain, thus limiting practice... Or, you were presented with an initial budget, and money was required, again, only to find a specific fact (see my few examples in this paragraph) hasn't or will DEFINITELY NOT come to be THEN, you may have a leg to stand on. Since something was 'in-print' or 'guaranteed', only to now be taken away...
Again, examples would be needed. |
Edited by - turntwo on 10/06/2015 11:53:48 |
|
|
|
2bbetter
3 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2015 : 13:28:58
|
| Big program vs. local team with one coach. |
|
|
|
CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2015 : 14:46:23
|
quote:
Originally posted by 2bbetter
Big program vs. local team with one coach.
Okay 2bbetter, I get that you are a person of few words but if we could have some more nouns and adjectives that would be great!
How could you think you were signing on with a BIG program and have it turn out it was a rinky dink local team with one coach? I mean was this like a one letter off thing, you thought you were signing up with the East Cobb Astros and you actually signed up with the East Corn Astros? I don't get it. |
|
|
|
turntwo
955 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2015 : 15:17:50
|
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
quote:
Originally posted by 2bbetter
Big program vs. local team with one coach.
Okay 2bbetter, I get that you are a person of few words but if we could have some more nouns and adjectives that would be great!
How could you think you were signing on with a BIG program and have it turn out it was a rinky dink local team with one coach? I mean was this like a one letter off thing, you thought you were signing up with the East Cobb Astros and you actually signed up with the East Corn Astros? I don't get it.
You mention East Cobb. I know they recently expanded, with the 'Team Wilson' brand, which if I'm not mistaken was kinda taking WPB (Canton-based out of Boiling Park?) under their umbrella. So, when you try out for "East Cobb" and "Team Wilson" makes an offer, you're ASSUMING you're on an "East Cobb" team, but from what I understand, most Team Wilson teams practice out of the old WPB fields, in Canton. Basically 'Team Wilson' teams are "East Cobb" in name (uniform/player fee/other requirements) only. |
|
|
|
lowandoutside
69 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2015 : 17:48:55
|
| You will find that this is the case with the majority of "East Cobb" teams. What may I ask were you expecting? Were you not aware that most "East Cobb" teams practice elsewhere. Typically "East Cobb" teams have 1 practice day each week at East Cobb. If you look through every age group and look at the "East Cobb" teams many state where they practice out of. You'll see other parks, high schools, high school softball fields, etc... If you didn't know going in that you wouldn't be at East Cobb all the time, I don't know that that is the coaches fault. I think most people know that when they sign up for "East Cobb" you will be practicing elsewhere. It is not just the "Team Wilson" organization. The Black Knights, some Colt 45s, the Pride, Braves, etc..... all have practices away from East Cobb every week. I hate to say it, but this is on you if you didn't realize that you weren't going to be practicing at East Cobb 100% of the time. |
Edited by - lowandoutside on 10/06/2015 18:09:15 |
|
|
|
2bbetter
3 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2015 : 18:33:14
|
| Folks, I have nothing against ECB. Both my boys have spent most of their time playing there. Someone else mentioned East Cobb, not me. The team we left is not an ECB team. |
|
|
|
CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 10/07/2015 : 07:37:54
|
quote:
Originally posted by lowandoutside
You will find that this is the case with the majority of "East Cobb" teams. What may I ask were you expecting? Were you not aware that most "East Cobb" teams practice elsewhere. Typically "East Cobb" teams have 1 practice day each week at East Cobb. If you look through every age group and look at the "East Cobb" teams many state where they practice out of. You'll see other parks, high schools, high school softball fields, etc... If you didn't know going in that you wouldn't be at East Cobb all the time, I don't know that that is the coaches fault. I think most people know that when they sign up for "East Cobb" you will be practicing elsewhere. It is not just the "Team Wilson" organization. The Black Knights, some Colt 45s, the Pride, Braves, etc..... all have practices away from East Cobb every week. I hate to say it, but this is on you if you didn't realize that you weren't going to be practicing at East Cobb 100% of the time.
My bad guys, I mentioned ECB as a flippant remark, perhaps I should have said maybe he thought he was signing up with 6-4-3 and actually signed up with 6-4-2? In either case now this is a whole new conversation about ECB.
To clarify, not every age group is the same when it comes to ECB. Not every age group has the top team being the Astros at ECB. And while it is true several ECB teams do not practice at ECB several DO practice exclusively at ECB. My son was on one of the Pride teams mentioned above and he ONLY practiced at ECB, with the exception of winter workouts.
A word of advice for those interested in ECB, the coaches will be up front with you about where they will practice, just ask. I know several parents who like the ECB name but REALLY like that their team doesn't practice all the way over in Marietta...to each their own.
As for 2bbetters problem, I would always follow the advice I gave previously. Don't pay all at once, and VET teams. Teams have history, you can see who they played last year from TC, USSSA, PG websites and see how they did and who they played. These boards that ask who is the best 9u team are more amusing than informative but at least it let's you know who the big fish potentially are. As for new teams, unless I knew the coach personally I wouldn't let my kid play for a brand new team. |
|
|
|
AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 10/07/2015 : 09:13:03
|
quote:
Originally posted by 2bbetter
Folks, I have nothing against ECB. Both my boys have spent most of their time playing there. Someone else mentioned East Cobb, not me. The team we left is not an ECB team.
Right, that was just tossed out there as an aside, but really there is no right answer to your question because we can't really tell what the issue is. My immediate take is that if you commit to a team and then de-commit, you don't get any money back, but there may be specific extenuating circumstances that we're not privy to that could change that answer.
|
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
Money back?
