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| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| AllStar |
Posted - 03/26/2015 : 08:07:55
...watch HS games and if they do, they just watch the kid they came specifically to see...
http://www.forsythnews.com/archives/24362/
A couple of lessons here.
1) Bring it every minute you're on the field. You never know who's paying attention.
b) Don't believe everything you read on an internet message board. 
Great kid, great family, great story. |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| GeorgiaBoy |
Posted - 05/07/2015 : 09:45:19
This is a terrific post... I'm new to this forum as it is my second day on this site and my first post. My son just finished what we believe will be his last season of rec ball... He's 9 & will be playing 10u travel next season. I'm reading all I can about the world of travel ball... It seems that the learning curve is quite steep. Post like this help give me perspective... Thanks
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
The short story is if you took a poll right now 90+% of the College ball players were contacted because of their Travel Ball teams. You may even be able to go 99+%!
These are the harsh truths of baseball. Here is an excerpt off of a website:
********
The following is a compilation of the odds for a high school player to either get drafted by a professional team or play college baseball.
Making the Pros
We will make some assumptions on the total numbers of players eligible each draft year.
High School Players @ 114,159 seniors
NCAA (4 year schools) @ 12,581 juniors & seniors
NJCAA (2 year schools) @ 11,520
COA (@ year schools) @ 2,175
That gives us 140,435 "draft eligible" players.
140,129/1,500 = 94
1 player in 94 will be selected in the Major League Baseball Draft
Playing in College
High School seniors = 114,159
College "seniors" (or sophomores when related to juco's) = 13,137
That means their are 114,159 graduating high seniors versus 13,137 slots open
114,159/13,137 = 10.1
1 high school player in every 10 has a chance to play in college
These numbers are not completely accurate, due to several reasons (foreign born players, players dropping out of school, etc.). But it is a fun look "At the Numbers."
******
Now if you are a scout or a head coach are you going to spend your time at a High School Baseball game with 2-3 very talented kids, or are you going to see the 18 Very talented travel ball players all on one team?
Is it possible to get recruited right out of HS for College and MLB without doing travel ball, yes of course! Is it likely, no, no it isn't. But I would agree that a player should play EVERY game with the same amount of effort and heart, no matter who they think is watching.
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| hshuler |
Posted - 04/19/2015 : 18:21:40
Wow...I've seen SEC teams run kid after kid in the 90's. |
| Diamond_dad |
Posted - 04/19/2015 : 14:18:07
I've been watching a lot of college baseball on tv lately and I've watched most of the top teams and I've only seen two pitchers throw in the 90's. I've seen quite a few kids during PG tourneys that throw in the 90's though, is it because when they get to the next level they lack consistency? Most of the kids that threw 90's against my kids teams normally struggled to throw strikes. |
| hshuler |
Posted - 04/17/2015 : 14:14:50
Yes, I think one has tendonitis and is shutdown for the foreseeable future. |
| Critical Mass |
Posted - 04/17/2015 : 11:49:41
Yeah, that kid won't be going to UGA. That's what i've heard on the street. He's one of two local pitchers to completely shut down Lambert this season, the other one is at Kennesaw Mountain. He 1 hit them over a 7 inning CG with 11ks. The hit was weak, like the leads from "Mitch and Murray"....fileted into LF. GA 2015's have a solid class of pitchers, although i have heard that 2 of the ones on top of the "radar"..and are not these two previously mentioned have "dead arms" and aren't anywhere near their velocity in Jupiter or ECP. Go figure. |
| bballman |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 20:57:43
quote:
Originally posted by hshuler
Again...Scouts are looking for tools. 94 is plus tool. The kid could not win a game and would still be drafted highly because it would be the job of the organization to develop the talent and teach him how to pitch.
Yep. If you throw 94, they will find you. 94 is a tool you cannot teach.
If you are the opposing pitcher throwing mid-80's, you better go looking for someone who wants you. No one is going to be going out of their way to find you. No doubt you can play baseball somewhere, but no one is going to be knocking down your door. |
| hshuler |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 18:06:53
Again...Scouts are looking for tools. 94 is plus tool. The kid could not win a game and would still be drafted highly because it would be the job of the organization to develop the talent and teach him how to pitch. |
| dgersh22 |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 17:14:02
brdymakr, where you watching the same West Forsyth vs. North Forsyth game I was. The young man that pitched did have his worst outing of the year for North his official line was 2 1/3 innings, 2 hits, 5BB, 1K, 3R, 1ER with 3 errors behind him. He has had anywhere from 12-20 MLB or scouting reps at every game he has pitched. I guarantee you none where college affiliated, he has already signed a letter of intent with UGA. His pitch mix that night was 66 pitches thrown of which 44 where fastballs, yes he touched 94, which is slower than what he has thrown most of this year and with better results (beat Lambert 2-1). All 17/18 year olds are going to have off games, just like many college/minor/major league players. In talking with some of the same scouts that have been there every game that he has pitched, they all stated that all kids have bad outings once in awhile. Believe me this young man does not get caught up in the "hype", for someone that will most likely be drafted in the early rounds in June he is the most down to earth, team guy out there. You should have stayed for the end of the game the final was 8-7! |
| brdymakr |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 12:42:15
Was just recently at a HS game between two county rivals in Forsyth. No less than 7 MLB organizations were present all with radar guns and backpacks with logos in full view. A dozen or so "other" radar guns were also visible but backpacks and logos were not (likely collegiate affiliations). Most/All were clearly there to see one kid, the starting pitcher for the visiting team. How do we know? Cuz as the Coach went to fetch him from the mound after 2 1/3 (8 hits and 4 runs all earned) the scouts (including the "others") quickly packed their guns into the backpacks and left. Kid threw 90% fastballs all over 94MPH by the guns we could see from behind and got lit up. The question I walked away with was..."I wonder if this kid was throwing so many fastballs cuz he and everybody else knew that was what the scouts were there to see?"...in the end it likely confirmed his velocity report, but hurt his location and pitch mix / pitch command report. It also didn't do much for his teams chances of winning the game either. Opposing pitcher was mid 80's with a solid pitch mix and had not given up a run through 5 innings when we left a 8-0 game... All kinds of scouts attend all kinds of games, don't get caught up in the "hype" and just play ball at your best and they will find you...keep the dreams alive for as many boys as possible and our great game will flourish. |
| bballman |
Posted - 04/03/2015 : 12:52:12
quote:
Originally posted by palm ball
Scouts want to see arm strength and speed with some athleticism Other skills can be taught and refined. You can not develop a 90+ fastball from a 70 MPH fastball, or the ability to shoot bullets across the infield to get a runner by a hair, or be taught to run sub 7 second 60 yd dashes (while speed can be marginally improved, you generally either got it or you dont) Scouts look for god given talents, getting the prospects talents/polished god given gifts, seen is the biggest factor to moving on in the game.
Game performance is watched and evaluated but by no means is it the final decision factor for kids, especially getting to play professionally. Colleges are looking for a little more polish in who they pursue.
+1. Agree with this. |
| palm ball |
Posted - 04/03/2015 : 10:17:00
Scouts want to see arm strength and speed with some athleticism Other skills can be taught and refined. You can not develop a 90+ fastball from a 70 MPH fastball, or the ability to shoot bullets across the infield to get a runner by a hair, or be taught to run sub 7 second 60 yd dashes (while speed can be marginally improved, you generally either got it or you dont) Scouts look for god given talents, getting the prospects talents/polished god given gifts, seen is the biggest factor to moving on in the game.
Game performance is watched and evaluated but by no means is it the final decision factor for kids, especially getting to play professionally. Colleges are looking for a little more polish in who they pursue. |
| CaCO3Girl |
Posted - 04/02/2015 : 14:15:47
quote:
Originally posted by DecaturDad
quote:
Originally posted by rippit
Okay I have a question...what happens when a D1 school offers a kid as a sophomore and then the kid just does nothing his junior or senior year in HS? And by nothing, I mean is completely overshadowed by the other talent on his HS team - some who have no such offer in hand?
See it 3-4 times a week. Just saying.
Realize that as a sophomore, all the kid has is a verbal agreement. If he does not continue to improve, there will not be a scholarship.
Agree! It's like locking in a low interest rate (the school calls dibs on that player), but if you don't qualify for the loan (or the talent level needed to play college ball) then the whole deal falls apart. |
| DecaturDad |
Posted - 04/02/2015 : 13:54:35
quote:
Originally posted by rippit
Okay I have a question...what happens when a D1 school offers a kid as a sophomore and then the kid just does nothing his junior or senior year in HS? And by nothing, I mean is completely overshadowed by the other talent on his HS team - some who have no such offer in hand?
See it 3-4 times a week. Just saying.
Realize that as a sophomore, all the kid has is a verbal agreement. If he does not continue to improve, there will not be a scholarship. |
| CaCO3Girl |
Posted - 04/02/2015 : 08:46:00
quote:
Originally posted by hshuler
Although they won't admit it, many parents view their kids as a lottery ticket. What other explanation would there be for acting so irrationally?
THEY ARE DRINKING THE KOOL-AID!!!!! That is the explanation for the irrational behavior. Our society has become pre-programmed to think EVERYONE is special (in their own way) and many parents are equating above normal motor skills at age 6 with natural ability that will result in a 30 million dollar contract at age 25!
My kid thinks for sure he will be a MLB player, and there is a needle in a haystack chance he will be, but in the meantime my only job is to help him find the best possible team/coaching where he can get substantial playing time and where he ENJOYS playing the GAME! Because it is a GAME people. If he announced tomorrow he wanted to take up ballet I would go find a board about that.
I would encourage all parents to let their children's success and failures be THEIR success and failures and not to tie their parental feelings and emotions into how far their children can go in the sport...if little Johnny broke his arm tomorrow in a bad way and could never pitch again would you love him any less? |
| Critical Mass |
Posted - 04/02/2015 : 08:29:20
I don't think it's the end of the world to play and rely on travel ball to get you better and seen, then ultimately signed to a college to play ball. In the case of the large turnout at tryouts and a quality player not making the team, travel ball is a fantastic option for him. I'm glad it's this way now....i know many guys who didnt have this option and they didnt make a team or maybe they made the team and didnt get to play and they were good....at that point they didnt have many options. Options are awesome. I hope your son does well and gets that ride to play ball.
My son was a split player as a Frosh...played varsity late in the year but primarily played JV. He dominated the opposing rosters as a rhp but wasnt really given the opp to play varsity as a pitcher. He was a SS and didnt perform well enough there to earn a spot over a Sr that year. He eventually lost a great opp to play ss as a Soph because he wasnt reliable there. He ended up in LF and did a great job. As a Jr he got a chance to start the 1st varsity game of the year and that was it. He locked up the #1 spot and never looked back. He will play acc ball next year, leaves in June for school. I like to tell people this story because he lost his primary position..ss was part of his dna if you ask him and he transitioned to P because his travel ball coach told him...."IF you are going to play college baseball, you will be a rhp." He started working on that position and is still doing that to this day.
Travel ball is great vehicle for kids who want it, bad...lots of other kids just wear the jersey and all the accessories for the cleat chasers. |
| Kory |
Posted - 04/01/2015 : 19:51:19
I think that the most disturbing phrase that constantly gets mentioned is "baseball only" or "football only". I'm not sure what scouts you have talked to, but the ones who I know, have all told my son to never quit playing football. That their organization looks for athletes who have a diverse background and who do not focus on a particular sport but concentrate on being an athlete and having a full life, which includes academics and a social life.
Football, in some cases, is worse than baseball. 8th graders are getting offers more regularly now, which is nuts. True, this is really isolated to QB's. But a QB, in the 8th grade, who has demonstrated a natural talent for throwing and can read a cover two, is a valuable asset. Plus most QB's are typically some of the best athletes so I guess I can understand that.
Regardless, I am really happy to read the story that started this thread. It sounds like the young man is a hard worker, and has a good head on his shoulders. That speaks to how he is being raised. We should all be so lucky. I doubt that that young man put his cup on that day thinking 'I hope there is a scout in the crowd.' So Bravo Zulu to him.
For those who have kids who didn't make their HS team, I would say keep working. Even MJ got cut his freshman year. But, please I would caution you from discussing the politics of the team, booster club, or coach with your son or daughter. Put the emphasis on hard work, not excuses. Or, you might end up with a bitter child. That would be a shame.
quote:
Originally posted by hshuler
Ohhh, it's an epidemic in all sports. Football only kids train year around and attend 'combines' as early as 6th grade. I heard someone say recently that their kid was rated a top ten corner back in the class of 2020. Really?
Although they won't admit it, many parents view their kids as a lottery ticket. What other explanation would there be for acting so irrationally?
|
| hshuler |
Posted - 04/01/2015 : 17:03:01
Ohhh, it's an epidemic in all sports. Football only kids train year around and attend 'combines' as early as 6th grade. I heard someone say recently that their kid was rated a top ten corner back in the class of 2020. Really?
Although they won't admit it, many parents view their kids as a lottery ticket. What other explanation would there be for acting so irrationally? |
| CaCO3Girl |
Posted - 04/01/2015 : 13:28:09
quote:
Originally posted by nastycurve
Are parents in other sports as delusional about talent as baseball parents?
I don't think the other sports have parents that are as delusional as baseball parents. We drink FAR too much of the kool-aid here in GA!
I have heard of 6 year olds in pitching lessons...9 year olds accepting a Pitcher Only roster spot and everyone with an academy type shirt thinks their kid is going to be the next great thing who will obviously be recruited because they have THAT shirt/name/brand! Here is a clue...with the rare exception each park/academy has one or two REAL teams, the rest of you/us (because yes my kid is at an academy) are fundraisers for those two teams, and that is okay, but don't be delusional about it!
I just don't hear these things about football and basketball...heck I can't name an academy type place for either of those sports! |
| bballguy |
Posted - 04/01/2015 : 13:11:29
It amazes me that some parents don't realize or don't accept that their kid simply isn't good enough to make the team. It's not end of the world!!! Life goes on and it's an opportunity to find new passions. |
| rippit |
Posted - 04/01/2015 : 12:44:26
Okay I have a question...what happens when a D1 school offers a kid as a sophomore and then the kid just does nothing his junior or senior year in HS? And by nothing, I mean is completely overshadowed by the other talent on his HS team - some who have no such offer in hand?
See it 3-4 times a week. Just saying. |
| nastycurve |
Posted - 04/01/2015 : 11:00:52
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
I am not saying that those kids who don't make their high school team are without talent. I am saying that if you don't have the talent to make your high school team, over a 4 year period, that you are unlikely to be talented enough to play in college.
That was the discussion....that if you plan on playing in college you had better have a really good answer to tell the recruiter on why you didn't make your High School team...and to tell him there are 20+ people better than me at my high school is probably not going to be an acceptable answer. Just my opinion people, everyone's got one!
Calcium Carbonate, I agree 100%. If you don't have the talent to make the roster of your HS, you are less than likely to make a college roster. You have to have some tool that you can bring to the team, your bat, your speed, leadership, pitching, SOMETHING.
I understand talented kids being ahead of you, that's why they make JV. Whats the excuse when the player is a senior and doesn't make it? "They had a bunch of really talented 11th graders, that's why I got squeezed off..." Weren't you a really talented 11th grader last year? What happened then?
Not saying all cases are the same, nor am I saying that politics don't exist, but I am saying if you can play, flat out play, you will make the team and play. If you are marginal at best, you may not make the team.
Are parents in other sports as delusional about talent as baseball parents? |
| AllStar |
Posted - 04/01/2015 : 10:03:45
quote:
Originally posted by Diamond_dad
My kid attends a school that's whose baseball team is one of the top ranked teams in the state and the school is full of talent and they had 12 returning seniors on the team and this year as a junior he didn't make the team. He's being actively recruited by several colleges including Div 1 schools. The coaches all asked for his travel ball schedule rather than his high school schedule. As much as I would like for him to be on the High school team, it seems like sometimes it doesn't matter. If he signs with one of the schools, I could really care less if he makes the High School team. It's there loss. Some schools have tons of talent and some don't. All of the surrounding schools in our area are terrible and we've been approached to attend other schools, but the academics at the school outweigh everything else.
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
I am not saying that those kids who don't make their high school team are without talent. I am saying that if you don't have the talent to make your high school team, over a 4 year period, that you are unlikely to be talented enough to play in college.
That was the discussion....that if you plan on playing in college you had better have a really good answer to tell the recruiter on why you didn't make your High School team...and to tell him there are 20+ people better than me at my high school is probably not going to be an acceptable answer. Just my opinion people, everyone's got one!
That is great! Congratulations! It also probably happens about as often as the story that started the thread. |
| Diamond_dad |
Posted - 03/31/2015 : 23:57:16
My kid attends a school that's whose baseball team is one of the top ranked teams in the state and the school is full of talent and they had 12 returning seniors on the team and this year as a junior he didn't make the team. He's being actively recruited by several colleges including Div 1 schools. The coaches all asked for his travel ball schedule rather than his high school schedule. As much as I would like for him to be on the High school team, it seems like sometimes it doesn't matter. If he signs with one of the schools, I could really care less if he makes the High School team. It's there loss. Some schools have tons of talent and some don't. All of the surrounding schools in our area are terrible and we've been approached to attend other schools, but the academics at the school outweigh everything else.
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
I am not saying that those kids who don't make their high school team are without talent. I am saying that if you don't have the talent to make your high school team, over a 4 year period, that you are unlikely to be talented enough to play in college.
That was the discussion....that if you plan on playing in college you had better have a really good answer to tell the recruiter on why you didn't make your High School team...and to tell him there are 20+ people better than me at my high school is probably not going to be an acceptable answer. Just my opinion people, everyone's got one!
|
| CaCO3Girl |
Posted - 03/31/2015 : 13:20:38
I am not saying that those kids who don't make their high school team are without talent. I am saying that if you don't have the talent to make your high school team, over a 4 year period, that you are unlikely to be talented enough to play in college.
That was the discussion....that if you plan on playing in college you had better have a really good answer to tell the recruiter on why you didn't make your High School team...and to tell him there are 20+ people better than me at my high school is probably not going to be an acceptable answer. Just my opinion people, everyone's got one! |
| AllStar |
Posted - 03/30/2015 : 14:08:49
quote:
Originally posted by BaseballMom6
CaCO3Girl - Easy - you have made a presumption that all schools host Freshman teams, ours does not. And when 8 catchers come out for the team, there is a glut of talent, if your child, like mine, is a catcher, especially if 2 excellent catchers, are returning. I find it interesting though that you think a player with a strong arm can just be moved to the outfield. Or that a player in their secondary position is going to naturally beat out a player in their primary position.
So when 60+ players tryout for 40 spots, it is not difficult for me to process that quality players will be cut.
Since you've been through the drill, you may already know about alternatives to HS ball. There is a 3+ year running thread in the 15-18 topic about Southern Prospects and some other options. It has bumped back up to the top and is in there now. "HS Alternatives?"
There is also a mention of alternatives in this more recent thread about HS teams.
http://www.nwgabaseball.org/snitz/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=44554 |
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