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| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Panther21 |
Posted - 04/15/2018 : 17:48:30
I have noticed each travel team - program charges different rates. I understand the money goes to gear, bags, etc , Plus entry fees. So some of the bigger programs:teams are treating like a business. Is that a correct assumption? |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Punishers |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 16:54:30
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
quote:
Originally posted by bama21
These disagreements about costs can go on forever. The more important factor is that you should be thankful that you live in this area.
Why, because you have options galore, as far as teams, to choose from. Georgia is loaded with quality teams/organizations. You can choose what team you want your son to play for and that can be based strictly on cost or any other requirement you may have. Also, I don't believe anyone is getting their arms twisted or being forced to join any certain organization.
I think the OP (three pages later)is getting quite an education here as to how crazy all of us youth baseball people really are.
No doubt. If I didn't deal with salesmen and their double talk every day, what some say would sound great.
Key words to watch out for:
1. development
2. representation
3. value
I heard these same exact words 10 times today from 10 different sales guys. |
| BamaDad |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 16:02:30
Agreed. It really doesn't matter until you get to the scouting ages. Last year, the dad-coached 12U East Cobb Tigers were 2nd best in GA and Top 10 in the country. They are top 3 in GA at 13u this year and still with all dad coaches. quote:
Originally posted by tbaillie2
Pay it or not. I don't give 2 craps how much money someone makes, in travel ball or business, if I think the value is worth the $ then I pay it. If it is 99% profit or whatever I don't care. If I write the check, it's on me to know what I am paying for. Now, if someone doesn't do what they said they would... that is another story, but I have no problem with a travel org making good coin.
Also love the continued bashing of 'dad coached' teams... it doesn't freaking matter before 13 or 14. It doesn't matter what level "they play at"... get the reps, get the playing time, get the fundamentals (more individual work/training than ANY 'team' will give). Up until 14'ish.. it just doesn't matter what team they are on, it really doesn't.
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| Bombernation |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 12:36:01
quote:
Originally posted by bama21
These disagreements about costs can go on forever. The more important factor is that you should be thankful that you live in this area.
Why, because you have options galore, as far as teams, to choose from. Georgia is loaded with quality teams/organizations. You can choose what team you want your son to play for and that can be based strictly on cost or any other requirement you may have. Also, I don't believe anyone is getting their arms twisted or being forced to join any certain organization.
I think the OP (three pages later)is getting quite an education here as to how crazy all of us youth baseball people really are. |
| CaCO3Girl |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 12:31:58
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
quote:
Originally posted by T13
Bombernation.....play one game as a pickup for a big academy team and they will add you to their list of kids they placed...
There are no pickups at our Academy. The roster is the roster. If a player is caught playing pickup for another team it usually leads to losing their roster spot on their team.
Humm...can't agree with that one. I do know that some kids push stuff WAY too far, and they need a forced break sometimes. However, if the kid is off from your team and he wants to play that weekend then what is wrong with that? Especially if he wants to play in a high profile event that you aren't participating in. 15u-17u is all about exposure. Isn't that what is best for the kid?
Now if he wants to ditch your team because you are playing in a TC event and another team is playing a PG event, then yes, that is very wrong. But if you are off that weekend, or day, I don't see the glitch. |
| tbaillie2 |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 12:27:16
Pay it or not. I don't give 2 craps how much money someone makes, in travel ball or business, if I think the value is worth the $ then I pay it. If it is 99% profit or whatever I don't care. If I write the check, it's on me to know what I am paying for. Now, if someone doesn't do what they said they would... that is another story, but I have no problem with a travel org making good coin.
Also love the continued bashing of 'dad coached' teams... it doesn't freaking matter before 13 or 14. It doesn't matter what level "they play at"... get the reps, get the playing time, get the fundamentals (more individual work/training than ANY 'team' will give). Up until 14'ish.. it just doesn't matter what team they are on, it really doesn't. |
| bama21 |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 11:25:30
These disagreements about costs can go on forever. The more important factor is that you should be thankful that you live in this area.
Why, because you have options galore, as far as teams, to choose from. Georgia is loaded with quality teams/organizations. You can choose what team you want your son to play for and that can be based strictly on cost or any other requirement you may have. Also, I don't believe anyone is getting their arms twisted or being forced to join any certain organization. |
| Punishers |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 10:20:38
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
quote:
Originally posted by Punishers
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
@Punishers
We all know what William said about protesting a bit too much. You are in 11’s. Still much to see for you.
More of an Einstein fan. Bill was a failure at math. Speaking of math, let do some uniform math.
Tops: $40 x 2 $80
Pants: $35 x 2 $70
Belts: $10
Socks: $10
Caps: $30
Total: $200
And this is on the high side with custom sublimated uniforms. Where does $550 come from? $350 Profit? The more you order the cheaper each individual item is.
Legit 11yo playing up to 13u to play with his class and classmates. I'll let you do the math on that one.
I said the $550 was uniforms AND practice fields.
That's not unreasonable. |
| Punishers |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 10:18:15
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
quote:
Originally posted by T13
Bombernation.....play one game as a pickup for a big academy team and they will add you to their list of kids they placed...
There are no pickups at our Academy. The roster is the roster. If a player is caught playing pickup for another team it usually leads to losing their roster spot on their team.
So you penalize a roster player if they pickup with another team for more exposure? No disagreement with you there. Cause that's who they should stay with or joined from the beginning. |
| Bombernation |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 09:57:52
quote:
Originally posted by turntwo
Don't people send out 'real-time' budgets, on a monthly basis? Almost like expense reports? Most of the teams we've been on, do. Never any question of 'where' the money goes. Receipts can even be provided. NOW, that doesn't mean someone ISN'T profiting-- such as the academy charging $20-$30 per jersey, yet you can find the same online for $12-$18. But that doesn't mean the TEAM is profiting, it means the Academy is... Are they actually "profiting" or are they just using the extra funds to redistribute to older teams, or fields/indoor costs/updates, etc. Even then, some of the academy's are .orgs (meaning non-profits). They have to file a 990 by Sept. 1st. They are public record. ANYONE can pull it and see where some of the 'hidden costs' go. No real mystery if you're 'in the know' or are the least bit astute.
Yep, the team business manager provides a detailed statement each month showing where every penny is being spent by line item. No sleight of hand. |
| turntwo |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 08:29:39
Don't people send out 'real-time' budgets, on a monthly basis? Almost like expense reports? Most of the teams we've been on, do. Never any question of 'where' the money goes. Receipts can even be provided. NOW, that doesn't mean someone ISN'T profiting-- such as the academy charging $20-$30 per jersey, yet you can find the same online for $12-$18. But that doesn't mean the TEAM is profiting, it means the Academy is... Are they actually "profiting" or are they just using the extra funds to redistribute to older teams, or fields/indoor costs/updates, etc. Even then, some of the academy's are .orgs (meaning non-profits). They have to file a 990 by Sept. 1st. They are public record. ANYONE can pull it and see where some of the 'hidden costs' go. No real mystery if you're 'in the know' or are the least bit astute. |
| Bombernation |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 07:21:32
quote:
Originally posted by T13
Bombernation.....play one game as a pickup for a big academy team and they will add you to their list of kids they placed...
There are no pickups at our Academy. The roster is the roster. If a player is caught playing pickup for another team it usually leads to losing their roster spot on their team. |
| CaCO3Girl |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 07:03:55
quote:
Originally posted by Punishers
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
@Punishers
We all know what William said about protesting a bit too much. You are in 11’s. Still much to see for you.
More of an Einstein fan. Bill was a failure at math. Speaking of math, let do some uniform math.
Tops: $40 x 2 $80
Pants: $35 x 2 $70
Belts: $10
Socks: $10
Caps: $30
Total: $200
And this is on the high side with custom sublimated uniforms. Where does $550 come from? $350 Profit? The more you order the cheaper each individual item is.
Legit 11yo playing up to 13u to play with his class and classmates. I'll let you do the math on that one.
I said the $550 was uniforms AND practice fields. |
| Punishers |
Posted - 04/30/2018 : 00:15:46
quote:
Originally posted by T13
Bombernation.....play one game as a pickup for a big academy team and they will add you to their list of kids they placed...
I know many kids that have done and are doing that exact thing. When Bombernation is quoting "representation" make me wonder are they acting as lawyers or agents for their players? And if so, are they getting they normal 30% cut at the end upon placement?
Remember at the beginning of this post when I said about getting a simple answer to a simple question. Bombernation just gave you a prime example of what I meant.
I swear they all read from the same script.
Punishers: Show me the numbers.
Bombernation: All our parents know the costs.
WTH??????? |
| T13 |
Posted - 04/29/2018 : 22:18:32
Bombernation.....play one game as a pickup for a big academy team and they will add you to their list of kids they placed... |
| Bombernation |
Posted - 04/29/2018 : 20:05:27
quote:
Originally posted by Punishers
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
quote:
Originally posted by Punishers
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
@Punishers
We all know what William said about protesting a bit too much. You are in 11’s. Still much to see for you.
More of an Einstein fan. Bill was a failure at math. Speaking of math, let do some uniform math.
Tops: $40 x 2 $80
Pants: $35 x 2 $70
Belts: $10
Socks: $10
Caps: $30
Total: $200
And this is on the high side with custom sublimated uniforms. Where does $550 come from? $350 Profit? The more you order the cheaper each individual item is.
Legit 11yo playing up to 13u to play with his class and classmates. I'll let you do the math on that one.
And you keep protesting. I said it before, not a Dad anywhere to be seen on that field. That costs money, and it’s also worth every penny.
Not protesting, just using common sense and numbers. You sound like the rest of the big name programs, push the same sales narrative of getting kids college scholarships without telling the truth that they will only get 20% athletic scholarship and not a full ride. And if they dont have the grades they may as well be a walk-on and take out student loans or go to D2, D3, or Juco or high round draft pick if possible. Then you hear the "well, you knows" and the "it is what it is" crap when all those so called connections will never materialize.
If I am understanding this correctly: You pad the cost of the uniforms to cover paid coaching? Why even have line item for paid coaches? Numbers don't lie, but words do. You say protesting, I say show me the numbers. Don't say I'm protesting when you are not willing to show it. Unless saying someone is protesting in your way of hiding the numbers.
I have no problem with a profit, just not a 100% + profit. Even retail profit is only 20% - 25%.
Big chunk of response for not protesting. It’s a 40k+ budget, and every parent knows exactly what the paid coaches are being paid. Conversely, every parent knows the reality of their kids talent and understands that there could be a “thanks but no thanks” regardless of the representation the player gets. I’m willing to pay the retainer to make sure that a flamethrower gets the best representation he can get at the right age.
|
| Punishers |
Posted - 04/29/2018 : 16:02:35
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
quote:
Originally posted by Punishers
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
@Punishers
We all know what William said about protesting a bit too much. You are in 11’s. Still much to see for you.
More of an Einstein fan. Bill was a failure at math. Speaking of math, let do some uniform math.
Tops: $40 x 2 $80
Pants: $35 x 2 $70
Belts: $10
Socks: $10
Caps: $30
Total: $200
And this is on the high side with custom sublimated uniforms. Where does $550 come from? $350 Profit? The more you order the cheaper each individual item is.
Legit 11yo playing up to 13u to play with his class and classmates. I'll let you do the math on that one.
And you keep protesting. I said it before, not a Dad anywhere to be seen on that field. That costs money, and it’s also worth every penny.
Not protesting, just using common sense and numbers. You sound like the rest of the big name programs, push the same sales narrative of getting kids college scholarships without telling the truth that they will only get 20% athletic scholarship and not a full ride. And if they dont have the grades they may as well be a walk-on and take out student loans or go to D2, D3, or Juco or high round draft pick if possible. Then you hear the "well, you knows" and the "it is what it is" crap when all those so called connections will never materialize.
If I am understanding this correctly: You pad the cost of the uniforms to cover paid coaching? Why even have line item for paid coaches? Numbers don't lie, but words do. You say protesting, I say show me the numbers. Don't say I'm protesting when you are not willing to show it. Unless saying someone is protesting in your way of hiding the numbers.
I have no problem with a profit, just not a 100% + profit. Even retail profit is only 20% - 25%. |
| Bombernation |
Posted - 04/29/2018 : 12:11:47
quote:
Originally posted by Punishers
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
@Punishers
We all know what William said about protesting a bit too much. You are in 11’s. Still much to see for you.
More of an Einstein fan. Bill was a failure at math. Speaking of math, let do some uniform math.
Tops: $40 x 2 $80
Pants: $35 x 2 $70
Belts: $10
Socks: $10
Caps: $30
Total: $200
And this is on the high side with custom sublimated uniforms. Where does $550 come from? $350 Profit? The more you order the cheaper each individual item is.
Legit 11yo playing up to 13u to play with his class and classmates. I'll let you do the math on that one.
And you keep protesting. I said it before, not a Dad anywhere to be seen on that field. That costs money, and it’s also worth every penny.
|
| Bombernation |
Posted - 04/29/2018 : 12:09:19
quote:
Originally posted by T13
Academy teams for younger ages just funding the 17u team.
Baseball scholarship is not you ticket to college- grades matter to D1 schools, it’s how they get your kid money.
Scouts are there looking at certain kids, not just browsing for talent.... they may ask about a kid occasionally but do they ever offer. Send videos to college and go to their camps if you want to be seen.
Or play for the top Academy team, where the owner has spent the last 10 years placing kids in colleges and forming relationships with the decision makers at those colleges? Sounds more efficient than sending out videos. |
| bbsis |
Posted - 04/29/2018 : 12:03:05
Uniforms must have profit built in. We've had numerous years with same academy team and players are required to order new every year (back pack, helmet, jerseys, belt, etc.) -- because it is "easier" for the coach/academy to place one large order instead of tailoring the order to what each player needs. I can see ordering new pants and perhaps replacing sweat-stained, stinky caps but so much is still in very useful condition. |
| Punishers |
Posted - 04/29/2018 : 08:29:02
quote:
Originally posted by Bombernation
@Punishers
We all know what William said about protesting a bit too much. You are in 11’s. Still much to see for you.
More of an Einstein fan. Bill was a failure at math. Speaking of math, let do some uniform math.
Tops: $40 x 2 $80
Pants: $35 x 2 $70
Belts: $10
Socks: $10
Caps: $30
Total: $200
And this is on the high side with custom sublimated uniforms. Where does $550 come from? $350 Profit? The more you order the cheaper each individual item is.
Legit 11yo playing up to 13u to play with his class and classmates. I'll let you do the math on that one. |
| T13 |
Posted - 04/28/2018 : 23:43:05
Academy teams for younger ages just funding the 17u team.
Baseball scholarship is not you ticket to college- grades matter to D1 schools, it’s how they get your kid money.
Scouts are there looking at certain kids, not just browsing for talent.... they may ask about a kid occasionally but do they ever offer. Send videos to college and go to their camps if you want to be seen. |
| T13 |
Posted - 04/28/2018 : 23:40:52
Academy teams for younger ages just funding the 17u team.
Baseball scholarship is not you ticket to college- grades matter to D1 schools, it’s how they get your kid money.
Scouts are there looking at certain kids, not just browsing for talent.... they may ask about a kid occasionally but do they ever offer. Send videos to college and go to their camps if you want to be seen. |
| Bombernation |
Posted - 04/28/2018 : 17:30:07
@Punishers
We all know what William said about protesting a bit too much. You are in 11’s. Still much to see for you. |
| SuperStar |
Posted - 04/28/2018 : 08:16:51
quote:
Originally posted by Punishers
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
quote:
Originally posted by SuperStar
@ Punishers
In 15U, we have 14 players at $3500.00 a piece with 10 tournaments scheduled. You do the math..., $49,000.00. So 40K is cheap. If you want to be on a top tier team and have talented coaches, you have to pay to dance!
At this point in time, it's all about the exposure and a chance for your kid to get a scholarship. Otherwise, we could go on a serious vacation somewhere nice!
15u, 15 players, 8 tourneys, $1800 fees, $550 for uniforms and practice fields, so $2350.
I think the difference is one paid coach for my kids team, vs. more for Superstar's kid.
You guys must be wearing uniforms laced with vibranium.
That's correct, it even comes with gold belts...,  |
| Punishers |
Posted - 04/27/2018 : 16:25:08
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
quote:
Originally posted by SuperStar
@ Punishers
In 15U, we have 14 players at $3500.00 a piece with 10 tournaments scheduled. You do the math..., $49,000.00. So 40K is cheap. If you want to be on a top tier team and have talented coaches, you have to pay to dance!
At this point in time, it's all about the exposure and a chance for your kid to get a scholarship. Otherwise, we could go on a serious vacation somewhere nice!
15u, 15 players, 8 tourneys, $1800 fees, $550 for uniforms and practice fields, so $2350.
I think the difference is one paid coach for my kids team, vs. more for Superstar's kid.
You guys must be wearing uniforms laced with vibranium. |
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