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Spartan4
913 Posts |
 Posted - 03/22/2011 : 20:56:14
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quote:
Originally posted by HomerunHitter
Most teams that lose lose because daddyball becaus the stick there kids high in the order while the best kids sit the whole game and not even bat in the tournament.
It is wrong to use the term MOST.....Most parents have the inability to take the blinders off and see that when the 10-11-12 kids come up they fail to have a productive AB. If daddy has a son that hits .500 he is gonna be in the lineup!! |
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HAWKS8
70 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2011 : 08:28:33
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I have noticed on a couple of posts the whole "daddy ball" comments coming into play. To clarify this, "daddy ball" can ONLY come into play if your son is NOT one of the top 9 players. If he is, there is no "daddy ball" but a coach putting in the 9 best. It is nice if they are the top 4-5 players as the opinion factor is out the window. If he is the 8-9 player, then is where the term will be used on most teams.
As for hitting continuous batting order, I see both sides. We happen to bat continuous, but that may just be from a habit on my part formed a long time ago. Since I did not specify how I would do this at the beginning, I feel it would be difficult to change this now and keep team chemistry in line. |
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gwinnettdad
16 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2011 : 08:59:50
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quote:
Originally posted by HAWKS8
I have noticed on a couple of posts the whole "daddy ball" comments coming into play. To clarify this, "daddy ball" can ONLY come into play if your son is NOT one of the top 9 players. If he is, there is no "daddy ball" but a coach putting in the 9 best. It is nice if they are the top 4-5 players as the opinion factor is out the window. If he is the 8-9 player, then is where the term will be used on most teams.
As for hitting continuous batting order, I see both sides. We happen to bat continuous, but that may just be from a habit on my part formed a long time ago. Since I did not specify how I would do this at the beginning, I feel it would be difficult to change this now and keep team chemistry in line.
Hawks8, gonna have to disagree with you on the daddyball comment. When a coach runs off player after player because he always puts HIS kid wherever HIS kid asks him to, thats daddyball too. Its human nature for a Dad to take care of his kid but its not fair to the team for a kid to be able to choose where he plays in the field JUST because his Dad coaches the team.
Also, it is not difficult to bat continuous when you only have 9 on the team !! LOL |
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Spartan4
913 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2011 : 17:53:45
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| If a coach is running kid after kid off there is probably a bigger problem than positions played. I know daddyball exists at the elite travel ball levels but it doesn't run rampant like it does in rec ball, when teams attract top talent they generally have to win to keep them around. If little johnny isn't very good then that team probably isn't going to be an extremely desirable destination unless he is the worst player on the team. I am thankful we bat 9 with the intentions of winning, if I had to deal with this "daddyball" I would pull my hair out. Glad we left rec ball at 8!!! |
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HomerunHitter
2 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2011 : 19:46:16
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| Well if your son can hit then thats a different story because most people do it because they didn't play enough on the last year team so the make a team so they can play more ball and feels like the star. |
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Spartan4
913 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2011 : 22:59:44
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quote:
Originally posted by HomerunHitter
Well if your son can hit then thats a different story because most people do it because they didn't play enough on the last year team so the make a team so they can play more ball and feels like the star.
And that my friends is why travel baseball is WAY TOO WATERED DOWN!! |
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linedrivedad
8 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2011 : 04:51:34
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I assure you at all levels daddyball is being played no mattier if it is rec, AA, AAA, or Major. I have seen it year in and year out on alot of teams and some that we have been associated with as well. The team we are on now the two coaches do not have a kid playing and that makes it a great position to be in because you can not get into a daddyball situation. We have all seen it through the years where most of the coaches feel that there son is alot better then what he is. When you have good ball players contacting you about playing and they let you know what positions that there kids play and you refuse them because your son or another coaches son plays that same position that is daddyball period. How do you know the new kid is not better?
The last time I checked a true Travel team a position needs to be earned not just handed to a kid. I have seen this for the past 5 years on my sons teams and no matter what level it does occur period. The only true way to ever avoid daddyball is to not have your kid playing. I have coached so you can bet no matter what you do at any given time you will be accused of daddyball as long as your kid is on the field and others sit.
As for batting at this age you should bat continuous until you get to bracket play. If you do have a kid struggling at the plate the more attempts he gets the better off he will be. Once bracket play begins then it is time to get serious and the best 9 or no more then 10 need to bat. The biggest problem I know of is teams wanting or getting too many players so it hurts them to bat continuous. With a true travel team if you can find 11 committed kids and parents you do not need any more then that with what we pay and the cost of travel you still have to be fair to all involved. Just one mans opinion is all. |
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Spartan4
913 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2011 : 11:25:51
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| I guess we should define "true travel ball"....I for one think that while I am sure there is a little daddyball going on at the major level, most of these teams just flat out couldn't win at the clip they do if little johnny was no good but playing premier spots. Our coach goes out of his way to be tough on his son, I think the term daddyball puts a bullseye on the kid's back. I have had a major problem with daddyball in the past but I find it funny we never hear about the coaches kid who hits .600 and throws 70!! I agree one million percent about earning your spot, linedrivedad makes a phenomenal point about no matter what you do as a coach every mistake your son makes will just be amplified!! I can promise you that with what my opinion of "true travel ball" teams like the Bandits, Team Florida, MBA Pride and Sandtown at this level "daddyball" doesn't seem to hurt them like it does in AA....JMO but the older we get the harder it is for daddy to hide his boy on the field IF AND ONLY IF you are playing tough teams. |
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G-Man
326 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2011 : 11:48:57
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I have to disagree just a small amount. Daddyball is very rare once you pass 13u if you are playing on a competitive travel ball team. By this time the speed and complexity of the game has passed most of those coaches knowledge base who have played daddyball in the past.
quote:
Originally posted by linedrivedad
I assure you at all levels daddyball is being played no mattier if it is rec, AA, AAA, or Major. I have seen it year in and year out on alot of teams and some that we have been associated with as well. The team we are on now the two coaches do not have a kid playing and that makes it a great position to be in because you can not get into a daddyball situation. We have all seen it through the years where most of the coaches feel that there son is alot better then what he is. When you have good ball players contacting you about playing and they let you know what positions that there kids play and you refuse them because your son or another coaches son plays that same position that is daddyball period. How do you know the new kid is not better?
The last time I checked a true Travel team a position needs to be earned not just handed to a kid. I have seen this for the past 5 years on my sons teams and no matter what level it does occur period. The only true way to ever avoid daddyball is to not have your kid playing. I have coached so you can bet no matter what you do at any given time you will be accused of daddyball as long as your kid is on the field and others sit.
As for batting at this age you should bat continuous until you get to bracket play. If you do have a kid struggling at the plate the more attempts he gets the better off he will be. Once bracket play begins then it is time to get serious and the best 9 or no more then 10 need to bat. The biggest problem I know of is teams wanting or getting too many players so it hurts them to bat continuous. With a true travel team if you can find 11 committed kids and parents you do not need any more then that with what we pay and the cost of travel you still have to be fair to all involved. Just one mans opinion is all.
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Hurricane
351 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2011 : 12:41:22
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| I have to disagree with this ""daddy ball" can ONLY come into play if your son is NOT one of the top 9 players. A coaches kid can be the best hitter on the team, a good outfielder but suck at Short. If the coach puts him at Short and there are 4 kids better with a better arm and footwork and you have them at 2B and 3B then that is daddy ball. |
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mlbscout
77 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2011 : 13:52:29
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"daddy-ball" is prevalent from t-ball through professional baseball in varying degrees. This type of favoritism can be due to family relationships, friendships, or personal benefits for the coach. Fortunately, as the kids get older it gradually diminishes but not completely does it disappear. Kids sometimes get picked on high school and college teams because they "know the right people". This is a way of life. Most travel teams, even the elite ones, suffer from this type of bias. I would bet, and likely win, that the Bandits, MBA, NC Canes, Team Florida, Sandtown, San Diego Stars, 643-DP, Team Phenom etc. all have someone on the coaching staff who has a kid on the team who most often wouldn't occupy that spot where it not for the relationship that exists. Occasionally the best player on the team is the coach's son. At other times, he is one of the weaker links. This problem is not only in baseball but in life in general.
quote:
Originally posted by linedrivedad
I assure you at all levels daddyball is being played no mattier if it is rec, AA, AAA, or Major. I have seen it year in and year out on alot of teams and some that we have been associated with as well. The team we are on now the two coaches do not have a kid playing and that makes it a great position to be in because you can not get into a daddyball situation. We have all seen it through the years where most of the coaches feel that there son is alot better then what he is. When you have good ball players contacting you about playing and they let you know what positions that there kids play and you refuse them because your son or another coaches son plays that same position that is daddyball period. How do you know the new kid is not better?
The last time I checked a true Travel team a position needs to be earned not just handed to a kid. I have seen this for the past 5 years on my sons teams and no matter what level it does occur period. The only true way to ever avoid daddyball is to not have your kid playing. I have coached so you can bet no matter what you do at any given time you will be accused of daddyball as long as your kid is on the field and others sit.
As for batting at this age you should bat continuous until you get to bracket play. If you do have a kid struggling at the plate the more attempts he gets the better off he will be. Once bracket play begins then it is time to get serious and the best 9 or no more then 10 need to bat. The biggest problem I know of is teams wanting or getting too many players so it hurts them to bat continuous. With a true travel team if you can find 11 committed kids and parents you do not need any more then that with what we pay and the cost of travel you still have to be fair to all involved. Just one mans opinion is all.
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G-Man
326 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2011 : 15:20:34
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Couldnt have said it better myself. Very well put and I agree 1000%
quote:
Originally posted by mlbscout
"daddy-ball" is prevalent from t-ball through professional baseball in varying degrees. This type of favoritism can be due to family relationships, friendships, or personal benefits for the coach. Fortunately, as the kids get older it gradually diminishes but not completely does it disappear. Kids sometimes get picked on high school and college teams because they "know the right people". This is a way of life. Most travel teams, even the elite ones, suffer from this type of bias. I would bet, and likely win, that the Bandits, MBA, NC Canes, Team Florida, Sandtown, San Diego Stars, 643-DP, Team Phenom etc. all have someone on the coaching staff who has a kid on the team who most often wouldn't occupy that spot where it not for the relationship that exists. Occasionally the best player on the team is the coach's son. At other times, he is one of the weaker links. This problem is not only in baseball but in life in general.
quote:
Originally posted by linedrivedad
I assure you at all levels daddyball is being played no mattier if it is rec, AA, AAA, or Major. I have seen it year in and year out on alot of teams and some that we have been associated with as well. The team we are on now the two coaches do not have a kid playing and that makes it a great position to be in because you can not get into a daddyball situation. We have all seen it through the years where most of the coaches feel that there son is alot better then what he is. When you have good ball players contacting you about playing and they let you know what positions that there kids play and you refuse them because your son or another coaches son plays that same position that is daddyball period. How do you know the new kid is not better?
The last time I checked a true Travel team a position needs to be earned not just handed to a kid. I have seen this for the past 5 years on my sons teams and no matter what level it does occur period. The only true way to ever avoid daddyball is to not have your kid playing. I have coached so you can bet no matter what you do at any given time you will be accused of daddyball as long as your kid is on the field and others sit.
As for batting at this age you should bat continuous until you get to bracket play. If you do have a kid struggling at the plate the more attempts he gets the better off he will be. Once bracket play begins then it is time to get serious and the best 9 or no more then 10 need to bat. The biggest problem I know of is teams wanting or getting too many players so it hurts them to bat continuous. With a true travel team if you can find 11 committed kids and parents you do not need any more then that with what we pay and the cost of travel you still have to be fair to all involved. Just one mans opinion is all.
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Spartan4
913 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2011 : 23:01:44
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| Wow!! I don't like hearing that.....I don't remember that from HS...Football was a little different with one or two dads who WOULDN'T LEAVE the practice field!! I just don't remember the really good travel teams being like that....Of course there weren't really classifications or 4 million teams per age group either so it was a different world. |
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mlbscout
77 Posts |
Posted - 03/25/2011 : 12:24:05
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Let me give you some examples of "daddy-ball"" at the professional level. John Schuerholz, general manager of the Braves, due to his influence, had his son Jonathan drafted by the Atlanta Braves. He didn't get far though. Al Campanis, general manger of the Los Angeles Dodger, used his influence to have his son Jim drfated by the Dodgers. He never amounted to much. Later, Al Campanis did have the guts to trade him to Kansas City. The current manager of the Detroit Tigers, Jim Leyland, had his son Patrick drafted by the organization. Think he'll make it to the Majors?
Sometimes things turn out well. Tom Lasorda, as a favor to his best friend, drafted his godson Mike Piazza in the last round of the draft. If these things happen in professional baseball, why would you be surprised to hear about them in travel baseball??
quote:
Originally posted by Spartan4
Wow!! I don't like hearing that.....I don't remember that from HS...Football was a little different with one or two dads who WOULDN'T LEAVE the practice field!! I just don't remember the really good travel teams being like that....Of course there weren't really classifications or 4 million teams per age group either so it was a different world.
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ramman999
241 Posts |
Posted - 03/29/2011 : 08:37:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Spartan4
If a coach is running kid after kid off there is probably a bigger problem than positions played. I know daddyball exists at the elite travel ball levels but it doesn't run rampant like it does in rec ball, when teams attract top talent they generally have to win to keep them around. If little johnny isn't very good then that team probably isn't going to be an extremely desirable destination unless he is the worst player on the team. I am thankful we bat 9 with the intentions of winning, if I had to deal with this "daddyball" I would pull my hair out. Glad we left rec ball at 8!!!
I think (and correct me if I am wrong) that there a few different types of daddy ball:
Type 1 is dad, who coaches (manager, assistant, other) and blatantly puts his son in front of more capable players in the field and in the batting order - true daddy ball- you see this more in Rec Ball, but it is everywhere, usually not above AA level - usually not tolerated long when you are talking the cost of travel ball
Type 2 is the dad whose son is an 8/9/10 player on a good team and sits/subs. Dad doesn't like that, so he takes his son, plus a few more disgruntled dads, and starts a team around them. Unfortunately, this is what is watering down travel ball from 12u on down. AA - AAA levels
Type 3 is Manager dad, whose son is skilled and playing where he should be, but because he is the coaches son it is perceived as favoritism by parents of weaker players. This coach will usually sub his son first at the expense of being called daddy ball. This usually causes Type 1 and 2 dads to leave, ironically because of what they perceive as "daddy ball" AA- AAA, possibly some weak Major level teams
Type 4 is Manager dad, who states from the beginning that playing time/position is merit based, and his son falls within the top 5 skilled players on the team, therefore does not sit. You'll see this more on the top teams that do not have independent coaches - this is called daddy ball for no other reason than the fact a dad is involved.
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