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rippit
667 Posts |
 Posted - 07/02/2015 : 15:30:05
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Anybody care to weigh in here? When do you draw the line? So you have kids who seem to always (mostly) make contact and you play them in spite of a really poor average.
Am I just now figuring out the difference between contact hitters, hits for average and hits for power?
What other stats indicate how effective a contact hitter really is? If a player is trained to "get a hit" vs "just make contact", won't this rear up and bite his backside eventually? |
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nwgadad
137 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2015 : 15:50:47
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Probably will get many versions on this.
I think hit for average is obviously the best, but I would rather have a contact hitter than a kid that consistantly strikes out (ie hits for power) and the contact hitter is more likely to have one get through. I also go by streaks. Highest average doesn't mean they are still hot at the moment. Hitting has a big mental side too so what are they being taught? |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2015 : 16:08:28
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When you strike out, it is impossible to get on base. If you always put the ball in play, there is always a chance you get on base. Then you have to look at the quality of those balls put in play. Does one player always square up the ball, but they are just going right to someone? Does the other player always seem to get little weak ground balls or bloopers over the infield that wind up hits? All this comes into play. A coach will generally prefer that hitter that always seems to square up the ball, even if his average is lower. Eventually, they will fall in for hits.
Of course there is more that goes into it, but generally speaking, the above is true. |
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turntwo
955 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2015 : 16:30:34
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Hard to be "making contact"... You can't hit for average with OUT making contact, correct? Sure, average is great, but... How about this, what if you have a kid hitting .400 and his OBP is 450. You have another kid that has an average of .350 but an OBP of .615. The higher average kid has more KO's and less BB's, BUT he does have a higher average. The lower average kid has nearly no KO's, 3x's as many BB's, and lots of ROE's (even though he may beat out infield hits, the judgement call is, is that a hit or ROE?), and FC's-- which can be detrimental if he's constantly hitting in front of runners and the defense is taking the lead baserunner.
I think a great stat is OBP. Whether BB, HBP, hit, or ROE, kids can't score if they're not on base. Correct? |
Edited by - turntwo on 07/02/2015 17:13:36 |
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Mad1
252 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2015 : 16:38:54
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I think the quality of the bats would dictate if the player stayed in the line up. For example , is he driving in runs with the contact hits that get him out, what is his on base percentage. If they are not productive in their contact hitting then I would look at it. We have two very fast contact hitters at the lead of our line up that constantly leg out infield hits with their speed if not line driving the ball through the gaps. Our three hitter is a pure hitter and has Gap power and just about everything he hits is hit Very Hard. Our four hitter is a pure hitter with tons of home run power and crushes a baseball. All four of these hitters have very few strikeouts and compliment each other very well. The three and four hitters have the most RBI's as they should because the contact hitters find a way to get on. If they are not scoring runs, moving base runners during their bats, or getting RBI's then I would say there's a problem. I agree with NWGA Dad and would prefer the contact hitter over excessive strikeouts from a power hitter, but really believe a coach can help with this by the way they set lineups up. I score for the team and We score all our games on Gamerchanger apps and the stats don't lie. The coaches constantly look at them and I provide them after each game or tourney to them for review and it keeps a pretty good line up for us.
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whits23
596 Posts |
Posted - 07/03/2015 : 10:58:27
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This is sort of where having a deep bench can help. maybe kid on 3rd you need a run you bring in a QAB or contact hitter.
I will say a contact hitter who can not put the ball into a gap IE out of infield is not much value day in and day out. So i guess they do have to have a decent average to boot as mentioned.
Baseball logic seems to be that you sacrifice power for defense up the middle and defense for power on the corners. 3/4/5 hitters .
Ideally you can have a fantasy team full of players who do it all but most teams are not blessed with mike trouts. |
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GeorgiaBoy
29 Posts |
Posted - 07/03/2015 : 13:52:58
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Good Stuff
quote:
Originally posted by turntwo
Hard to be "making contact"... You can't hit for average with OUT making contact, correct? Sure, average is great, but... How about this, what if you have a kid hitting .400 and his OBP is 450. You have another kid that has an average of .350 but an OBP of .615. The higher average kid has more KO's and less BB's, BUT he does have a higher average. The lower average kid has nearly no KO's, 3x's as many BB's, and lots of ROE's (even though he may beat out infield hits, the judgement call is, is that a hit or ROE?), and FC's-- which can be detrimental if he's constantly hitting in front of runners and the defense is taking the lead baserunner.
I think a great stat is OBP. Whether BB, HBP, hit, or ROE, kids can't score if they're not on base. Correct?
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2015 : 08:48:25
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| Contact kid hands down over the kid who gets a hit but has a greater chance of a strike out. I also agree that OBP is a really great stat. It's been my experience that the contact kid usually does get hits, but more importantly, it's his job to move the runners. A kid who can consistently hit away and allow that runner on second to advance is priceless, even if his batting average doesn't say so. That's why this is a TEAM sport, it isn't just about individual averages, it's about working as a team to get the job done. |
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turntwo
955 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2015 : 10:16:25
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quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
Contact kid hands down over the kid who gets a hit but has a greater chance of a strike out. I also agree that OBP is a really great stat. It's been my experience that the contact kid usually does get hits, but more importantly, it's his job to move the runners. A kid who can consistently hit away and allow that runner on second to advance is priceless, even if his batting average doesn't say so. That's why this is a TEAM sport, it isn't just about individual averages, it's about working as a team to get the job done.
Truer words have NEVER been spoken! AMEN!!! |
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hshuler
1074 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2015 : 10:59:15
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I think the original question was kids who make contact or kids who get hits? Give me the kids who get hits, even of they strike out twice as much. The quality of the at bat is definitely what's important and sometimes contact alone is as useless as a strikeout if it doesn't produce anything. Producing runs or doing something that leads to producing runs is the mark of a good hitter.
Taking a kid who is hitting .450/50 RBI with 20 K's over a kid who is hitting .290/18 RBI with five K's is a no-brainer in my book. What I've learned is that the older you get, the better the defenses are so contact alone doesn't cut it. Kids better figure out how to square it up consistently if you want to be a good hitter. You can have a kid with great hand/eye and bad mechanics who can make a lot of 'soft' contact and that won't get it done at the higher levels. |
Edited by - hshuler on 07/06/2015 11:06:26 |
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KeithB
282 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2015 : 12:13:32
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| My son is a contact hitter with a pretty high OBP, and very low strikeouts (~5 in ~75 AB's). He put the ball in play just about every time. I agree he needs to develop a little power to turn ground outs in to base hits. |
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Kids who make contact vs kids who get hits
