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rmang
8 Posts |
 Posted - 03/21/2009 : 22:19:17
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We are playing in the 12u Junior Grizzlies Round-up and below are rules as they appear on their web-site:
After pool play games, teams will be ranked 1-16 based on the following:
1) W-L Record
2) Head to Head
3) Runs Allowed
4) Runs Scored
5) Run Differential
6) Coin Flip
Teams 1-8 will play in a single elimination Championship Bracket on Sunday at Dwight Terry. Teams 9-16 will play in a single elimination Consolation Bracket on Sunday at Macedonia Park and Holly Springs.
12U Grizzlies Roundup Championship Bracket
Highest Seed will be the home team
Trophies for Champion and Runner Up
12U Grizzlies Roundup Consolation Bracket
Highest Seed will be the home team
Game locations will be determined Saturday
Team Plaque for Consolation Champion
We were informed tonight that we are the 10 seed even though we defeated the 9 seed 3-2 in a head-to-head game.
The tournament director told us that they couldn't use the head-to-head item because we didn't play the same teams.
I understand we can't use head-to-head if it doesn't exist but since in our case, it does exist with the #9 seed - why wouldn't we use it.
The difference is 2 more hours of sleep and playing against a team that won this same 11u tourney last year vs. a team that gave up 30 runs in 2 game this year - and we have to drive 20 more minutes!
Can someone make sense of this?
Thanks |
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caughtstealing
20 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 23:27:06
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| Not sure I know all the facts but if what you're saying is accurate I would say your team is getting yanked around. |
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clemsonnun
52 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 23:59:44
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I am the Jr Grizzlies Tournament Director and the question was a very good question. After talking to several others that run USSSA tournaments I was told to follow the comment to Rule 4.10 USSSA rules:
Rule 4.10 Comment: Once advanced to the next tie breaker criteria, do not return to a previous criteria.
It is my interpretation that being a 16 team tournament and 8 teams being 1-1 that going to head to head could not be done with 8 teams being they did not all have common opponents and games, therefor we went to Runs allowed. Based on the Rule 4.10 comment we did not go back to previous criteria.
I think we did the right thing but by no means are we prone to mistakes. Can others clarify so that we can make sure our wording in information is more clear in the future.
I would also like to say the team questioning have truly been true sports about this and did not argue the circumstances. |
Edited by - clemsonnun on 03/22/2009 07:40:10 |
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RZENTKO
112 Posts |
Posted - 03/22/2009 : 02:22:07
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HELLO RMANG, IN USSSA PLAY RULE 5.14 NOTE SAYS;
Rule 5.14 Comment: Once advanced to the next tie breaker criteria, do not return to a previous criteria.
THEREFORE IN A MULTIPLE TEAM TIE BREAKER IT IS VERY POSSIBLE TO BE SEEDED BELOW A TEAM YOU DEFEATED. HOPE THIS HELPS
5.14 Pool Play / Tie Breaker Criteria:
5.14.A Head to Head
5.14.B Runs Allowed (Versus All Teams Played Not Just Tied Teams)
5.14.C Run Differential (Maximum +/- 8 Runs Per Game.)
5.14.D USSSA Point System
5.14.E Coin Flip
I AM SURE THEY ARE TRYING TO FOLLOW ESTABLISHED RULES. GOOD LUCK IN YOUR TOURNAMENT |
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rmang
8 Posts |
Posted - 03/22/2009 : 21:03:12
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Got it.
Head-to-head would rarely come into play unless two team were tied with the same record in a 4 team pool play situation and were competing for the top seed coming out of their pool AND they played each other in that pool.
Using head-to-head, as a tie breaker, in a 16-team tournament with 2 pool play games is mathematically impossible.
Tim and his team ran a great tournament.
Thanks…
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clemsonnun
52 Posts |
Posted - 03/22/2009 : 23:08:31
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I just saw another tournament which made alittle more sence where they went W-L record, runs allowed, runs scored, head to head.
Thnaks for all replies |
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Tournament seeding question
