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teddy41
421 Posts |
 Posted - 02/22/2016 : 12:54:51
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Big programs charging big money and having too many teams and not having any fields space so they have to troll other teams for scrimmages or shared practices at all sorts of locations.
signed getting tired of it |
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OPHornets
135 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2016 : 09:17:14
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*AMEN*
Let me throw a disclaimer out that I do sit on the board at Oregon Park so I may be a bit biased. Year after year, we see more and more kids leaving our park to play on travel teams without a home field. For three years, my team has enjoyed 3 practice slots a week at fields near our homes and those fields are every bit as nice (often nicer) than what we play on over a weekend. We've had enough opportunities to fundraise that I expect our total fee this year to be about $750 - $1000/player and that includes the Cooperstown fee.
I get the allure of some programs and academies but I don't get the fascination of playing for a name without a *guaranteed* home who hopes for field time. Too many horror stories out there of broken promises.
I guess it boils back down to what everyone says all the time: find the right coach in the right program for your kid and do your homework.
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teddy41
421 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2016 : 10:09:21
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Not to mention they try to sell hopes and dreams of scholarships or making high school team based on being on the B or even C team at a academy and then they rarely play tournaments. Having had 2 kids play high school i can tell you coaches do not care what your team name was in the summer they want to see what you can do on tryout day.
Not to mention same kids pay over 3 to 4 K a year and then hop from one academy to the next. Find a team that offers playing time, lots of games and get your reps. Learn the game and how to play it with respect and learn to listen to your coach not your parents. |
Edited by - teddy41 on 02/23/2016 10:28:45 |
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turntwo
955 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2016 : 10:12:43
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*Devil's Advocate*
Plenty of rec parks out there, even some with travel programs, that do not have the field space, nor the care, to cater to their 'in-house' travel teams-- or even their rec teams for that matter.
From what I've heard, there could be some tremendous value at certain academies. Again, this is just based on what I've heard, but for only $200 per YEAR you get access to some amazing fields at East Cobb. Of course this is just he 'player fee' that ECB charges, and isn't included in the teams independent budget, but with most (if not all) teams getting 2 practices at week AT the facility, again, that's a nice bang for buck. But again, I could be WAY off with this, as it's just what I've heard. |
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stealyourbase
81 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 09:31:31
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If getting tired of it, why go back? It's the same argument with tournament complaints. Why play in the same tournaments year after year and then complain about poor fields, poor organization, poor this, poor that?
Nobody else is to blame but ourselves. Why change if we keep spending time, money, etc when we already know the end result? Seems pretty cut and dry to me! Plenty of alternatives out there if unhappy. |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 09:40:12
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quote:
Originally posted by turntwo
*Devil's Advocate*
Plenty of rec parks out there, even some with travel programs, that do not have the field space, nor the care, to cater to their 'in-house' travel teams-- or even their rec teams for that matter.
From what I've heard, there could be some tremendous value at certain academies. Again, this is just based on what I've heard, but for only $200 per YEAR you get access to some amazing fields at East Cobb. Of course this is just he 'player fee' that ECB charges, and isn't included in the teams independent budget, but with most (if not all) teams getting 2 practices at week AT the facility, again, that's a nice bang for buck. But again, I could be WAY off with this, as it's just what I've heard.
I have to say, this is not what I have heard. Yes, everyone at ECB has to pay the $200 fee...but I'm not really sure what that is for and I can't see how ALL the teams get 2 days a week practice.
I just went to the ECB website and counted 14u-18u teams and there are 39 of them! Since they all play on the same field size that would mean they would need 78 practice slots per week, and Friday is usually a tourney, so that would be Monday-Thursday. Um, I know ECB is large, but I don't think they have enough fields to cover all that!
Makes you wonder if 643, and places like it, have the better idea of 3 teams per age group max. Having 12 16u teams like ECB seems a bit much...kind of dilutes the name one would think. |
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turntwo
955 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 10:11:57
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quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
quote:
Originally posted by turntwo
*Devil's Advocate*
Plenty of rec parks out there, even some with travel programs, that do not have the field space, nor the care, to cater to their 'in-house' travel teams-- or even their rec teams for that matter.
From what I've heard, there could be some tremendous value at certain academies. Again, this is just based on what I've heard, but for only $200 per YEAR you get access to some amazing fields at East Cobb. Of course this is just he 'player fee' that ECB charges, and isn't included in the teams independent budget, but with most (if not all) teams getting 2 practices at week AT the facility, again, that's a nice bang for buck. But again, I could be WAY off with this, as it's just what I've heard.
I have to say, this is not what I have heard. Yes, everyone at ECB has to pay the $200 fee...but I'm not really sure what that is for and I can't see how ALL the teams get 2 days a week practice.
I just went to the ECB website and counted 14u-18u teams and there are 39 of them! Since they all play on the same field size that would mean they would need 78 practice slots per week, and Friday is usually a tourney, so that would be Monday-Thursday. Um, I know ECB is large, but I don't think they have enough fields to cover all that!
Makes you wonder if 643, and places like it, have the better idea of 3 teams per age group max. Having 12 16u teams like ECB seems a bit much...kind of dilutes the name one would think.
Annnnnndddddddd I knew I'd be proven wrong, or questioned. I was just speculating. Not part of ECB, nor ever have been. Just have friends that play there... Here's what I've been told. The $200 'player fee', is for "up keep and maintenance of the fields". Sure, it ALSO could be for those higher level 'premier teams' that the kids don't pay. Who knows. BUT, let's be honest, we pay $180 for REC ball for the spring only, for PITIFUL fields, 1x practice a week-- UNTIL games start, then NO practice times. So, $200 for POTENTIALLY 2x's a week (I'm talking let's say 8-12U).
Next question, would SOME of the teams 'work out' together? I just looked at the team lists... Would/could/do all the 60/90 Astros work out together? Since the Stros, are well, the Stros, do they actually practice together? MOST 60/90 kids are playing middle/high school ball right now anyway, right? So how many teams (of the 76 you quoted) are actually "practicing" together? I'd say A LOT of those 14-18U teams will converge and work out 1-2x's a MONTH starting in May-ish (once school ball is over). Other than indoor tee work, or reps in the cages-- which ECB has plenty, no?
Again, I'm probably WAY wrong again, and will be corrected shortly by The Omniscient One. |
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wasup
3 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 10:16:18
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quote:
Originally posted by teddy41
Not to mention they try to sell hopes and dreams of scholarships or making high school team based on being on the B or even C team at a academy and then they rarely play tournaments. Having had 2 kids play high school i can tell you coaches do not care what your team name was in the summer they want to see what you can do on tryout day.
I do not agree with your statement above regarding coaches not caring about the name of your summer team organization. When my son went to individual college camps and national showcases like Top 96 coaches approached my son and asked how long he has been playing in that organization. The coaches even goes as far as asking how certain coaches in that organization are doing which led me to believe that they have built relationships. As a result, I believe that my son's summer team's name helped my son get a little more attention than other kids in camps and showcases, and my son recently committed to a D1 school as a Junior in High School. I am not saying that this is true ALWAYS but I truly believe the summer team name really helps. Just my $.02. |
Edited by - wasup on 02/24/2016 10:53:55 |
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SoxIn7
42 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 11:17:01
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There are a lot more fields being used than one may realize.
I will just keep it at that |
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hshuler
1074 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 11:31:48
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@wasup - Don't sell your son short. I think it had more to do with his skill level than summer team.
Some organizations have brand recognition but ultimately a kid has to able to play. |
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BamaDad
188 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 11:38:42
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| First year with an academy team. However, I have seen how some teams utilize fields other than the academy-owned fields. Not sure if this is preference due to proximity to the majority of the coaches/team or due to lack of practice slot availability. To the point about organization name on the jersey. It's about exposure when you get to a certain age. HS/College coaches and Scouts build relationships with travel-team coaches who have proven that they train and develop top-notch talent year after year. They attend these coaches' practices. While you may not be one of the headliners on the team, you may catch the eye of the individuals because they spend so much time at your practice. |
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DecaturDad
619 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 12:34:51
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At the HS level, playing for a coach who is known and respected can make a difference. My son was invited to visit a D1 school last fall. He was coming off an injury, so the coaches had only seen him bat, not play the field. The head coach told my son that his travel coach, who he knew well, said he was one of the best corner outfielders in his class. That was enough to get him on campus.
Now, a kid still needs the skills. But it does help to have contacts. |
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wasup
3 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 14:01:25
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quote:
Originally posted by hshuler
@wasup - Don't sell your son short. I think it had more to do with his skill level than summer team.
Some organizations have brand recognition but ultimately a kid has to able to play.
@hsuler, I agree with you completely. His hard work is what ultimately got him the offer. |
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hshuler
1074 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 16:07:12
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| Great life lesson for him...congrats and best wishes on a long and prosperous baseball career! |
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bigroc19
158 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2016 : 16:30:06
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| ECB $200 Reg...covers insurance and practice fields (2x a week) |
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catmando
107 Posts |
Posted - 02/25/2016 : 16:12:57
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| Not all ECB teams use ECB and some of the time slots are horrible. There are some big box programs in forsyth and fulton i have had issues with as they pile teams on teams during practice |
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BlazeTheDiamond
15 Posts |
Posted - 02/25/2016 : 20:19:53
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| Also regarding ECB fees, I feel that it is disingenuous stating that the total is $200 when you are required to pay a $135 tryout fee also. This fee is mandatory even if your child does not attend the official tryout and is recruited later on. So if you combine both, your "fee" for the year is really $335. The value in that is purely speculative based on individual opinions. I just think (and it has been suggested to the park owner) that both these fees should be lumped together for ease of payments and clarity. Unfortunately, these payments are currently set up at different times in the year (tryouts are August & and new year player fee begins January), so this just adds to the confusion if you are joining a team say in Dec./Jan. and you have to pay the "tryout" fee that took place last summer. But, like most things that are well oiled, the rig keeps turning and I guess it's not the priority over there to make a change in this area of bookkeeping. Oh, and on occasion some of the older teams will combine a practice, the organizations that have multiple teams 15/16/17 for example. |
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turntwo
955 Posts |
Posted - 02/26/2016 : 09:33:03
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quote:
Originally posted by catmando
Not all ECB teams use ECB and some of the time slots are horrible. There are some big box programs in forsyth and fulton i have had issues with as they pile teams on teams during practice
I've heard that... That younger (8/9U) teams get 8-10 PM slots, where as the 12 or 13U teams get the more desired 5-7 PM slots. Or a 8U team practicing on a 54/80 field, with no way to move bases, and mound is permanent. Doesn't see very 'customer friendly', but then again, I do not know what the 'rthyme or reason' that goes into assigning practice times.
But, I guess it's ECB's way of saying 'we DID offer/give you 2 slots a week'-- now if the coach has access to a field at a better time, or more convenient location to his core team, then I'd say that's HIS choice as coach, and has nothing to do with ECB. |
Edited by - turntwo on 02/26/2016 09:38:09 |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 02/26/2016 : 09:57:19
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Two additional things about all this ECB stuff.
1. The $200 is only the fee for playing at ECB. There are other fees you must pay to play on the team you are on. These fees will include uniforms (which you must purchase through ECB sponsor), tournament fees, coach fees (if paid coach is used) and any other costs that the team incurs and passes on to the families. It doesn't only cost $200 or $335 to play at ECB.
2. The practice times are assigned early in the year. Once baseball season actually starts, if your practice time occurs while there is a tournament going on and the field is being used for the tournament, you don't have the field for practice. So, you really aren't getting practice 2x per week if your time coincides with a tournament that is scheduled. |
Edited by - bballman on 02/26/2016 10:40:44 |
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same thing each year
