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2boysbaseball
9 Posts |
 Posted - 08/27/2009 : 17:20:46
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| This topic may have been discussed here before so please forgive me if it has been covered, I am pretty new to the site. I would like to know what is the difference between the classifications? Is it mainly pitching or a combination of pitching/hitting? I was also thinking it may be that there are no easy outs. What are your opinions? Thanks |
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Storm Baseball
212 Posts |
Posted - 08/27/2009 : 22:34:04
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About 3 months ago...
Reggie
46 Posts
Posted - 05/21/2009 : 08:00:15
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Like I said I am new to the travel baseball. what seporates the AAA teams from the Majors teams.
Watching many games this season I think it has to do with pitching and a really good catcher. Am I right on this or is there something I am not seeing.
loveforthegame25
117 Posts
Posted - 05/21/2009 : 09:27:02
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Reg, I believe the difference is also Depth. Our team has 4 kids that can catch at the Major level, and 8 that can pitch. You also have a deeper batting order. The major level may have 7 or 8 kids that can hit consistently, where the AA or AAA may have 4 or 5. Does this make sense??
Dr. Old School
203 Posts
Posted - 05/21/2009 : 09:29:41
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You are right. Pitching depth is a major factor. Most AAA teams have a top pitcher that can shut teams down in a one game set. The problem comes in playing 5 games in a tournament. I also see a difference in the defensive setting as well. As you mentioned, a strong catcher is one seperation. Having good defensive depth seperates the major teams from the AAA as well. Experience is probably the other big difference. Many of the players on Major teams succeed at that level, because of their experience in playing in highly competitive games. They know how to go out and execute their job and have a good idea of what is coming at them.
Storm Baseball
33 Posts
Posted - 05/21/2009 : 10:09:03
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Reggie, in a nut shell, you are mostly correct. On any given day, in a one game showdown, some AAA teams can hang with a Major team and sometimes beat them. But where major teams have the advantage over the AAA's is in pitching depth. Major teams can go 5-7 deep in "stud starters" whereas a AAA team may only have 1-3 equivalant.
I think for some teams, it is an ego trip to be a Major but honestly, they are probably some Major teams better suited for AAA. And it goes in reverse, some of the upper class AAA teams, should be in Major but geographic limitations don't allow some of them to play enough Major teams to create a viable schedule. USSSA, in opinion, does a good job of moving the better AAA teams up to Major the following year.
For us, we are a AAA team and it "allows" us to play 54 other AAA teams and if we wish, we can play up to play another 26 teams at the Major level.
Sometimes it is not so cut and dry...
tater77bug
117 Posts
Posted - 05/21/2009 : 12:52:41
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1. Pitching depth...most Majors can trot 6 to 8 pretty strong starters out...
2. Catcher...most have 1 stud and a few quality back ups...
3. Defense...the RF is really good on a Major team...not as many holes in other words..
4. Consistant....hitting...pitching...defense...coaching....
It sort of the difference between Georgia and Georgia Southern...Southern can be tough but Georgia can line up deeper all day long...again AAA teams can be very hard to deal with in smaller tourney's for Major teams...but when you get to game 4 of bracket play is a real divide...
bmoser
427 Posts
Posted - 05/21/2009 : 14:38:03
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Reggie,
My son has now played for AA,AAA, and Major teams in the 10U usssa classification. Only subbed 3 or 4 games in Majors, but enough to see the differences.
I agree with all I have read here on this topic, but would add 2 more factors...age and size.
Most Major teams have some very large boys. Very few AA, and AAA have more than 1. I've asked enough parents to know that most Major teams are comprised of boys with a disproportianate number of boys with May,June, July, August birth dates. When you combine age AND size (they dont always go hand in hand), they become meaningful factors. This has been reflected in who makes it to the major leagues. Youth league cutoffs, and size play a role in who makes the bigs, and this trend is becoming stronger over time, especially for pitchers.
This is another reason to love the 10u Bandits. Only 1 jumbo sized boy, 1 average sized, the rest small. If you have a small to average sized son playing, or one with a bad birth date, or both (as I do) take him to watch the Bandits and you will pump up his self esteem and efforts.
longhorn1
43 Posts
Posted - 05/21/2009 : 22:22:01
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Depth is deffinetally key. Pitching & hitting. Very good players on every level of team.
Reggie
46 Posts
Posted - 05/22/2009 : 13:38:07
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"This has been reflected in who makes it to the major leagues. Youth league cutoffs, and size play a role in who makes the bigs, and this trend is becoming stronger over time, especially for pitchers"
I dont understand what this means? How can a birthday determine a players success in the major leagues? So is it an advantage to play up or down? What if you hold a child back a year in school? In one year wont the underage player be the same age as the older player? Do scouts care about your age? How does the cutoff effect your skill level. I would think scouts are looking at skill not age when kids are older unless i am reading Major leagues as travel Major teams not MLB
bmoser
427 Posts
Posted - 05/22/2009 : 17:51:41
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Reggie,
Taterbug hit the nail on the head. After our AA/AAA team gets eliminated Saturday, we just want to pack up the car and head home, but I've learned a lot by sticking around a few times to watch what happens next.
Most of the time the difference doesnt hit you over the head with a 2x4, its quite subtle. First few times I thought to myself, "we can beat these teams'. Most dont throw 65 mph, dont hit it over the fence all the time, or make diving catches like you might expect.
They (higher class teams) do the small things well. Think total bases while you watch. They are like a Chinese torture test...drip...drip..drip. Like a vice closing so slowly, you cant even see it move.
Major hitters put the ball into play, get around the bases like jackrabbits, and their pitchers throw stikes. Its all the boring small stuff that you come to appreciate after you see it enough times. Then these boring non-events start to add up.
The mental acuity of higher class teams is quicker and sharper. You can't watch the game passively to see this. Dial in. This part is is the toughest part to teach.
Put 9 kids on the field who do these things consistently, or have these attributes, and they are tough to beat.
bmoser
427 Posts
Posted - 05/23/2009 : 07:51:08
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several studies have been done about Major League baseball players birth dates. Just Google it and read a few. There is a non-disputable correlation between birth month and making the bigs. Its been tied back to youth baseball age cutoffs. Even when the Jan 1st became May 1st, you can see the shift ripple through the Majors years later when those players hit their 20's.
For pitchers, you can find charts and graphs showing their height through the years as compared to the U.S. average and non-pitching MLB'ers. Very few pitchers under 6 feet tall are making it to the majors any more...unless he's a lefty :)
quote:
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Originally posted by Reggie
"This has been reflected in who makes it to the major leagues. Youth league cutoffs, and size play a role in who makes the bigs, and this trend is becoming stronger over time, especially for pitchers"
I dont understand what this means? How can a birthday determine a players success in the major leagues? So is it an advantage to play up or down? What if you hold a child back a year in school? In one year wont the underage player be the same age as the older player? Do scouts care about your age? How does the cutoff effect your skill level. I would think scouts are looking at skill not age when kids are older unless i am reading Major leagues as travel Major teams not MLB
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bmoser
427 Posts
Posted - 05/23/2009 : 08:14:42
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Here's 1 link below discusing birth months of MLB players. Years ago, July 31st was the youth baseball age cutoff, so today, more Major Leaguers have August birth months than any other month. Even Division winners have more August birthdates than non-Division winners!
http://jonahkeri.com/2009/01/03/outliers-and-baseball/
There are many more studies showing this. Not just for baseball either, this one mentions hockey too.
A shift from August towards May has aleady begun and will continue unless Internatioanl play impacts American youth leagues to adopt the Jan 1 cutoff.
Back to the original thread topic, what are the differences between AA/AAA/Majors? Age/Birthdates and size are 1 identifiable difference. USSSA Major teams have a lopsided number of May,June,July, August birthdates.
Anomolies always exist. The Georgia Grip are the youngest 10U Major caliber team I know of. They have a few 9's, and even 1 8 yr old!
Even so, 7 of them have May-August birthdates...some are just playing up.
Coaches of Major teams of any age: Do any of you have more boys w/ birth months of Sept-Dec (8 months) than May-August (4 months)???
quote:
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Originally posted by Reggie
"This has been reflected in who makes it to the major leagues. Youth league cutoffs, and size play a role in who makes the bigs, and this trend is becoming stronger over time, especially for pitchers"
I dont understand what this means? How can a birthday determine a players success in the major leagues? So is it an advantage to play up or down? What if you hold a child back a year in school? In one year wont the underage player be the same age as the older player? Do scouts care about your age? How does the cutoff effect your skill level. I would think scouts are looking at skill not age when kids are older unless i am reading Major leagues as travel Major teams not MLB
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ECBdad
9 Posts
Posted - 05/24/2009 : 15:00:05
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I highly recommend the book mentioned in the link. It discussed many other similar topics and is not all sports related. It also shows the cutoff's for other sports having similar results from hockey to soccer as well.
quote:
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Originally posted by bmoser
Here's 1 link below discusing birth months of MLB players. Years ago, July 31st was the youth baseball age cutoff, so today, more Major Leaguers have August birth months than any other month. Even Division winners have more August birthdates than non-Division winners!
http://jonahkeri.com/2009/01/03/outliers-and-baseball/
There are many more studies showing this. Not just for baseball either, this one mentions hockey too.
A shift from August towards May has aleady begun and will continue unless Internatioanl play impacts American youth leagues to adopt the Jan 1 cutoff.
Back to the original thread topic, what are the differences between AA/AAA/Majors? Age/Birthdates and size are 1 identifiable difference. USSSA Major teams have a lopsided number of May,June,July, August birthdates.
Anomolies always exist. The Georgia Grip are the youngest 10U Major caliber team I know of. They have a few 9's, and even 1 8 yr old!
Even so, 7 of them have May-August birthdates...some are just playing up.
Coaches of Major teams of any age: Do any of you have more boys w/ birth months of Sept-Dec (8 months) than May-August (4 months)???
quote:
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Originally posted by Reggie
"This has been reflected in who makes it to the major leagues. Youth league cutoffs, and size play a role in who makes the bigs, and this trend is becoming stronger over time, especially for pitchers"
I dont understand what this means? How can a birthday determine a players success in the major leagues? So is it an advantage to play up or down? What if you hold a child back a year in school? In one year wont the underage player be the same age as the older player? Do scouts care about your age? How does the cutoff effect your skill level. I would think scouts are looking at skill not age when kids are older unless i am reading Major leagues as travel Major teams not MLB
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BREAMKING
82 Posts
Posted - 05/27/2009 : 12:54:39
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But did not the last age change make more of a difference grade wise. Eventually everybody has to compete against there own grade level. I always felt having a b-day that allowed you to play with the grade ahead helped you when you got to high school. I wonder what the percentage of 5th graders vs. 4th graders were on 10u travel teams. Probably mostly 5th graders. I always feel that if the 4th graders can compete with the 5th graders when they get to school ball which is really when it starts counting they are better off. I have seen many of kids that got dropped down in league age wise with the cut off date changed a couple of years ago. Some of these kids if playing with other 4th graders would not even make a team but do really well against 3rd graders. Man that is complicated and probably did not state my point good at all. lol...
southpawmom
12 Posts
Posted - 05/27/2009 : 16:01:07
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Another perspective - major teams have more kids that can identify a pitch as it comes out of the pitcher's hand and adjust to hit it. You might not see this so much at 10, but as you move up in the age bracket and the kids start to see a greater variety of pitches, kids that hit great at 10 suddenly can't hit at 12 and 13. Why? Because they're guessing - not seeing and adjusting to each pitch. A AAA team might have 1 or 2 studs that can identify pitches and make the adjustments, a major team will have a lot more. Ever heard the term "Hit the mistake"? You've got to be able to identify it and make the adjustmet to hit it.
who
11 Posts
Posted - 05/29/2009 : 12:09:35
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I think there is another factor that someone briefly touched on earlier but I believe deserves more attention. Call it the "X - factor", gamesmanship, or anything equivalent, but I'm referring to mental toughness. This is not simply having the ability to perform a task, but the instantaneous reaction knowing what to do, when to do it, then actually implementing it. And more often than not, they make the play. Think about the task being something as simple as an infielder diving to attempt to keep a ball in the infield, or an outfielder sprinting 25 times across the field to back up a throw when maybe only 1 out of the 25 gets to him. Those other 24 times are just as important, otherwise he wouldn't have been in the right spot the 25th time when he was needed to field the ball. It's the desire to accomplish those tasks successfully. It's the self satisfaction felt when a task is accomplished. I've heard some refer to this as having baseball awareness. I believe you can partially teach this, but most of it has to come from within. Many kids that have more of this mentality seem to gravitate to playing catcher, but at the older ages maybe 12 -13 , this mental toughness is seen at other positions as well. The major teams will typically have more of this type players than AAA teams, and in turn those teams will likely have more than AA, A, etc. Anyone ever watch the "top 10 plays" on ESPN's Sportscenter most mornings ? Next time they show a play, watch the player after he /she just made the spectacular play. Most of the time they are not smiling afterwards. It's serious to them. That's the point.
loveforthegame25
117 Posts
Posted - 05/29/2009 : 18:08:20
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has anyone mentioned the coaching???? Is the coaching better at the major level??????
bmoser
427 Posts
Posted - 05/29/2009 : 21:56:11
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In most cases yes. But not all.
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Originally posted by loveforthegame25
has anyone mentioned the coaching???? Is the coaching better at the major level??????
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baseballpapa
436 Posts
Posted - 05/29/2009 : 23:56:00
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I wouldn't even say in most cases as I have seen many good coaches in the AA and AAA ranks. I would say that some of the best coaches are in the major ranks but then again it is easier for the coach to look smart when he has the team to back up his strategy.
bmoser
427 Posts
Posted - 05/31/2009 : 08:49:38
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The Wills Park Yellow Jackets (AAA) Coaches impress me a lot.
In AA, I like the Georgia Redbirds (AA)Coaching. (I'd add my sons Coaching staff to the AA list too, but I'm biased).
quote:
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Originally posted by baseballpapa
I wouldn't even say in most cases as I have seen many good coaches in the AA and AAA ranks. I would say that some of the best coaches are in the major ranks but then again it is easier for the coach to look smart when he has the team to back up his strategy.
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ljames
48 Posts |
Posted - 08/27/2009 : 22:59:21
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Generally speaking the level of play gets a lot better as you go from AA to Major. Also the errors per game decreases and the level of talent in the kids increases. The number of good pitchers on a team also increases up to the Major level. What I mean by that is if you took those pitchers on a Major team and put them on an AA or AAA team most times they would become the "ace", but on the Major level they could be #4 or #5. The teams are also a lot deeper all the way around (pitching, defensively, batting lineup, etc.).
I will tell you that you do find teams that are classified as Major that should not be. The coach wants to play on the Major level but the team is not a Major caliber team. This can also work in reverse. A team classified as AAA that should be classified as Major and beats up on all the AAA competition. A coach can classify a "new" team at whatever level he chooses. It's best to classify the team truly based on their talent level and not ego or it could be a long season. |
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goyard
217 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2009 : 07:58:05
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Many things contribute I think but above all to me is PITCHING DEPTH, DEPTH, DEPTH, DEPTH, DEPTH....and did I say DEPTH?!?  |
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2boysbaseball
9 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2009 : 09:42:51
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| I appreciate the responses. Is it safe to assume that the classification is more of a measurement of the team and not the individual player? I guess the question I am asking is how to rank a player in order to know what level they should play? Is such a ranking even necessary for a 13u player? How do you know when it is time to move to the next level? My son played last season at the AAA level. |
Edited by - 2boysbaseball on 08/28/2009 11:36:35 |
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ECB_Insider
54 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2009 : 14:14:28
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2boysbaseball,
It is more important for a player to be on a team they can contribute to than worrying about the classification. You know it is time for a player to move up classification levels when they are the top player on a team, and are no longer being challenged. Make sure they don't move up too high in one jump. Going from being the top player on one team, to being in the bottom 3 of another will not be beneficial to their development.
Know that every AA team has at least one AAA player, every AAA team has at least one Major player but also at least one AA player. Major teams have the most major players but do have some AAA players that help to provide support. Elite teams don't have any AAA players.
The thing you cannot do is take the coaches word for what level of team he has. Look at the history of the team and the players they have coming. Just because a coach says they are playing Major does not mean they will be successful at that level. You can look at the record for a lot of teams, last year, and see losing records. Just do your research. |
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ljames
48 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2009 : 16:36:43
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The classification is a collective measurement of the individuals that make up the team.
When deciding when it's time to move you have to take an HONEST look at your son's skill level compared to kids on his team and other teams at his current level. If you and your son feel that based on his skill level it's time to move, then it's time. If you and your son feel that he could compete on the Major level without struggle I recommend going to a tryout. Whenever a move to another level is considered there should be an HONEST assessment taken although not all parents are able to do this. If you were just making the move to travel ball you would have to do the same evaluation but only at a lower level like AA. It's time to move based on an individual skill progression. Was your son one of the better players on his team? How did your son perform at AAA? Did the team play some of the better ranked AAA teams? If so, how did he perform in those games? These are just some of the questions that should be answered HONESTLY. |
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Difference between AA, AAA and Major
